Comments on: Just Because It’s Not Painful, That Doesn’t Mean You’re Not Learning /just-because-its-not-painful-that-doesnt-mean-youre-not-learning/ You don't know a language, you live it. You don't learn a language, you get used to it. Sat, 04 Jul 2020 16:09:19 +0900 hourly 1 https://wordpress.org/?v=5.1.13 By: mattgirod.com » Blog Archive » One Month Report /just-because-its-not-painful-that-doesnt-mean-youre-not-learning/#comment-27541 Sun, 08 Nov 2009 15:23:23 +0000 /?p=254#comment-27541 […] myself, “Am I really learning anything?  Really? I’m just reading sentences.” I am reassured though as I explain […]

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By: Seth /just-because-its-not-painful-that-doesnt-mean-youre-not-learning/#comment-17167 Wed, 18 Mar 2009 20:43:12 +0000 /?p=254#comment-17167 I’m up to about 650 sentences. I’ve been at it for about a month and a half. First off, its really fun. The cards I make are audio and a picture on the question side, and the text in on the other, with definitions mostly in japanese (some in english cuz I get lazy). So with this ‘new’ format for cards that I got from your chinese project, I find that I am getting good at knowing readings of kanji in regular text, being able to associate a word with its kanji from my memory, and also my listening comprehension is a little better too. But one thing that I am not ‘feeling’ like I am getting better at, because I have no way to know, is recalling words from… the abyss of memory. Because in the card the word is always being provided for me both through audio and visually. In that respect I never have to work for the word. Whats your comment on this Katsumoto? Will this come eventually.? Whats a good way to excersize this aspect of your linguistic capacity? That is, just trying to say something you want… ;p

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By: Will /just-because-its-not-painful-that-doesnt-mean-youre-not-learning/#comment-11943 Sat, 18 Oct 2008 22:59:25 +0000 /?p=254#comment-11943 First time I saw the keywords with story I was sceptical but i thought I’d see if my little sister wanted to do it as she found heisig was to hard (she is only 10). Amazing we just did an hour of kanji with no crying no getting board and fun.

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By: khatzumoto /just-because-its-not-painful-that-doesnt-mean-youre-not-learning/#comment-9217 Mon, 16 Jun 2008 14:08:02 +0000 /?p=254#comment-9217 @Rob
>one could easily add 50 sentences daily to the SRS
My bad. That was a magic number. One COULD, but whether one does or not is another matter entirely. I didn’t. As you grow in Japanese, you will get faster, and be able to add more.

>When I started I had a bad habit of adding long and sometimes multiple sentences to one card which slowed things down.
I had this bad habit, too. SRS items need to be short, short, short. Definitely sentences, but definitely short. It should be like popping bubblewrap: a small, satisfying effort that can be repeated over and over.

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By: khatzumoto /just-because-its-not-painful-that-doesnt-mean-youre-not-learning/#comment-9216 Mon, 16 Jun 2008 14:04:25 +0000 /?p=254#comment-9216 @anders
That’s an interesting question…give me some time to think.
For now, I’d say, find some things that interest you enough to be worth adding.
Also, if you’re adding from text, consider making sure it’s electronic (copy-pastable) text. That’ll save some time.

Also don’t worry about it too much. Regular review/reps are more important than regular additions, IMHO.

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By: khatzumoto /just-because-its-not-painful-that-doesnt-mean-youre-not-learning/#comment-9213 Mon, 16 Jun 2008 13:58:39 +0000 /?p=254#comment-9213 @nest0r
>I’ve noticed my listening and writing skills have increased very quickly
Me too! I can write like champ, and I’m also far less dependent on seeing something in text to find out what it means.

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By: khatzumoto /just-because-its-not-painful-that-doesnt-mean-youre-not-learning/#comment-9212 Mon, 16 Jun 2008 13:56:40 +0000 /?p=254#comment-9212 @Rob
>Perhaps a balance of all of the SRS methods may be the way to go?
Hmmm…maybe. Try it out!
I tend to go for “one pill/method/ring to rule them all”, but that’s simply a personality trait.
That’s sounds like a cool experiment you have ready to go there…

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By: khatzumoto /just-because-its-not-painful-that-doesnt-mean-youre-not-learning/#comment-9211 Mon, 16 Jun 2008 13:54:57 +0000 /?p=254#comment-9211 @Saru Sponge
Thanks for that idea. I’m working on a linear “table of contents” right now, so one can view AJATT logically/by topic rather than just chronologically…

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By: AwkwardMap /just-because-its-not-painful-that-doesnt-mean-youre-not-learning/#comment-9130 Sun, 08 Jun 2008 18:19:49 +0000 /?p=254#comment-9130 @Rob

I know exactly what you mean about the long sentences thing. I thought I wouldn’t be learning unless it was filling up a couple of lines on my SRS. Yeah, except that meant that my sentences for the day were more or less shot and I was killing the great thing about the method: bite-sized chunks that are easy to swallow.

Smaller sentences means more sentences, so that has helped a lot.

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By: Rob /just-because-its-not-painful-that-doesnt-mean-youre-not-learning/#comment-9129 Sun, 08 Jun 2008 15:32:47 +0000 /?p=254#comment-9129 @anders

I have the exact same problem. I too always do my daily reps, but it seems after I’m done that I just don’t have time (or energy) left for additions. I was curious as to how Khatzumoto could state in the beginner section that one could easily add 50 sentences daily to the SRS. I thought I must be doing something wrong.

That’s why I’ve decided to do a mix of all four SRS methods. Before I was doing the dictation method only, where I would find a sentence, rip the audio or create it in Neospeech, look up the new words, copy and paste everything into Anki, check the hiragana, then write the sentence. That whole process takes considerable time.

Now I also use the method Khatzu used originally, which is just adding the sentence and hiragana only. Also one thing I try and do is find shorter sentences. When I started I had a bad habit of adding long and sometimes multiple sentences to one card which slowed things down.

I’ve only just begun using the mix SRS methods, but so far I’m averaging around 15 adds a day, which is a lot better than before when I was lucky to do 5.

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By: anders /just-because-its-not-painful-that-doesnt-mean-youre-not-learning/#comment-9128 Sun, 08 Jun 2008 10:56:37 +0000 /?p=254#comment-9128 I’ve got a question regarding sentence adding.

I started doing kanji and sentences 13 months ago. I’ve got 6000 items in mnemosyne at the moment (including kanji).
I do reps every day and usually miss 1 day every 2 months or so, and have never gone more than 2 days without doing any reps at all.

But I haven’t gotten into a good habit of adding sentences every day. Sometimes I go several weeks without adding anything. And this is of course way below my goal of ~30 adds per day. For example, if I’m reading Yahoo!知恵袋 there is usually a lot of sentences that I could add to mnemosyne, but I usually don’t bother because it seems so troublesome and continue to read on.
So I was wondering if khatzumoto or anyone else who has been able to get into a habit of adding stuff everyday could share some tips.

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By: Mallory /just-because-its-not-painful-that-doesnt-mean-youre-not-learning/#comment-9119 Sat, 07 Jun 2008 02:32:14 +0000 /?p=254#comment-9119 Will do. Thanks a bunch!

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By: Sutebun /just-because-its-not-painful-that-doesnt-mean-youre-not-learning/#comment-9113 Fri, 06 Jun 2008 17:08:41 +0000 /?p=254#comment-9113 Mallory…

Get some kind of small rectangular box. Split into 5 sections that are large enough to hold the flashcards.

Then do the spacing yourself exactly like at kanji.koohii.com/learnmore.php

Or, if you have enough time to use the computer, you can use that website without having to save anything to your computer.

But if you don’t, here is the spacing it uses:
Box Days
1 0 days (incorrectly answered cards)
2 3 days
3 7 days
4 14 days
5 30 days
5 60 days
6 120 days
7* 240 days

So just label sections and physically move the cards. You probably also need tp make a card spacer then to separate cards reviewed at different times; so say today you are putting cards into box 2. At the top of all those cards, make another card that says something like “Review in Three Days: 6/06/08”. Then have a paper where you record your schedule. So it would say like “6/09/08: Box 2, review cards from 6/06”, so that you know to check that box. So:

-Have some way to physically separate cards into different piles that are following intervals.
-Make sure to have some way to separate cards within a box since a box can contain cards from many different review days.
-Have a way to keep track of cards in the box, and then make a schedule so you can get those cards and review them when needed.

It may seem a little complex, but it should work out pretty simple. As long as you don’t knock all the cards over and mix them, you should be fine 😛

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By: Mallory /just-because-its-not-painful-that-doesnt-mean-youre-not-learning/#comment-9112 Fri, 06 Jun 2008 14:59:17 +0000 /?p=254#comment-9112 Hey, I just have a couple questions, if it’s okay.

I don’t have access to a computer very often, and when I do, I can’t save anything onto it. Can I do an SRS kind of thing with flash cards? I’ve been doing that, putting the English meaning on front and the kanji on back, and seeing how I do. I’ve learned about maybe 100 kanji in three days. Am I doing something wrong? Thanks–….

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By: nest0r /just-because-its-not-painful-that-doesnt-mean-youre-not-learning/#comment-9109 Fri, 06 Jun 2008 07:47:35 +0000 /?p=254#comment-9109 That’s right, a romance language. The language of L-O-V-E.

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By: nest0r /just-because-its-not-painful-that-doesnt-mean-youre-not-learning/#comment-9101 Thu, 05 Jun 2008 15:57:30 +0000 /?p=254#comment-9101 Khatzumoto, just wanted to say thanks for posting your Chinese project notes–I’m enjoying starting your method modified with active recall TTS/images right from the get go, being sort of a guinea pig. Yesterday, I added images to the new cards, and it just clicked for me, and I’ve noticed my listening and writing skills have increased very quickly from just the few TTS cards I’ve done, despite it being slow going. I’ll tell you how it goes a few months or a year from now. ^_^ I think I’ll try this laddering method you spoke of eventually as well, though with a Romance language rather than Chinese.

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By: 774 /just-because-its-not-painful-that-doesnt-mean-youre-not-learning/#comment-9096 Thu, 05 Jun 2008 07:59:40 +0000 /?p=254#comment-9096 Hi Khatzumoto, I found an “unique interactive massively multiplayer online role playing game for learning Mandarin Chinese.” called zon and thought you would like it.

enterzon.com/

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By: Daniel /just-because-its-not-painful-that-doesnt-mean-youre-not-learning/#comment-9094 Thu, 05 Jun 2008 05:53:31 +0000 /?p=254#comment-9094 AwkwardMap,
I think some of how the keyboard input schemes works reflect how often Japanese people actually use the kanji. In fact, just one week ago, I used the kanji 偶 for たま with a very intelligent and multilingual Japanese person, and he was like “I’ve never seen this kanji before,” and then when I told him it was “たまに” he was like “…ohhhhh.” So good chances are, if it doesn’t come up easily in your input method, you should probably just go with hiragana.

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By: AwkwardMap /just-because-its-not-painful-that-doesnt-mean-youre-not-learning/#comment-9092 Thu, 05 Jun 2008 02:44:30 +0000 /?p=254#comment-9092 Off-topic, but you check the newest post most often, so:

I noticed that sometimes when I look a word up and then try to type it out it’s not on that list that pops up when one hits space. For instance, I just looked up たま, or 偶 as it appears in the dictionary and then when I try to type that out, that kanji is not on that list.

I’ve seen this happen with some other words as well, none right off the top of my head that I can think of, though. So why does this happen? Just not written that way commonly? (It was written out in kana in the source material.)

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By: lloyd /just-because-its-not-painful-that-doesnt-mean-youre-not-learning/#comment-9091 Wed, 04 Jun 2008 22:43:22 +0000 /?p=254#comment-9091 great post, khatz! one of the best, i think! keep up the good work, man and as always thanks!

exclamatation point-crazy,
lloyd

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